Interview with prominent Nepali herpetologist Prof. Dr. Kalu Ram Rai ‘Khambu Sir’ of Tribhuvan University, Nepal
Professor Rai at his working
laboratory in Fuhlrott Museum, Wuppertal, Germany in 2002
Namaskar Sir! How are your days
going on?
Namaskar! Thanks for your question.
Formally, it’s going well. As routine work I go to campus (Mechi Multiple
Campus, Bhadrapur) to take my classes. Thereafter, I will remain at home with
my computer and family.
Please, would you tell something
about yourself?
What and how to tell something about
myself! It’s difficult to reply you. By the way, which aspect would you like to
know from me? Actually my life is divided into social, academic and research
aspects respectively. In brief, socially I am related with several social
organizations, professionally I am a University Professor and in research I did
my specialization in Herpetofauna of Nepal.
I have published following books:
- Mero Anusandhan Yatra (in Nepali), 2010
- Amphibians of Kangchenjunga and Singalilla Complex, 2011
- Khambu’s Way: Crossroad in a New Land (Published by ARCO Spain, Tabernas), 2018
- Chaya ko Laskar (in Nepali), 2019
I have also co-authored in different
books:
- Amphibians and Reptiles of Nepal (2002). (Eds. Schleich & Kästle). A.R.G. Gantner, Germany.
- Perspectives of Animal Ecology and Reproduction (2008). Daya Publication, New Delhi. Vol. IV & V.
- Field Guide to Amphibians and Reptiles of Nepal (in English and Nepali) (2013). ARCO-Nepal, Kathmandu.
- Herpetofauna of Nepal (Amphibian, Turtles, Lizards and Snakes) - A Children’s book series online publication available in website for free download at www.arco-nepal.de (2016).
I think that’s all!
Most students are familiar about the
definition of research, but what does your experience say about research?
Yes, it is very interesting question.
Every students and beginner of research project thinks research would be as defined
in a dictionary. But in practicality it is not so. Biological research is
totally based on field observation. Thus, with my gained experience, its simple
meaning is an attempt of solving certain problem by doing fieldwork and
collecting data diligently as well as honestly to achieve the final goal. Many
students or research scholars start their research work but are afraid of
fieldwork later on and leave it at half way. Such activity makes me unhappy. So
I suggest them not to start without firm determination.
How did you get absorbed into the
world of amphibians and reptiles?
Since my childhood, I was interested
to observe the egg laying activity of local frogs and lizards in their breeding
time at my ancestral hometown. Thereafter, as a coincidence I became student of
Zoology during my campus and University life and then became teacher in the
same subject. After gaining experience of University teaching job, I began my
PhD; first in ‘Limnology’ but when I met with a famous herpetologist Prof. Dr.
Hermann Schleich, then I changed my topic to ‘Eco-herpetology’. After a long struggle,
I succeeded to receive my PhD under the joint guidance of Supervisors Prof. Dr.
Umakant Ray Yadav (Tribhuvan University) and Prof. Dr. Hermann Schleich (Munich
University) on this subject. Thus it fixed me in this position.
What is the scenario of Nepal’s
herpetofauna?
Nepal is rich in herpetofauna diversity.
Since a long time, it has been hotspot for many species of amphibians and
reptiles. On distributional view, they are abundantly found in eastern region
in comparison to the western region of Nepal. Likewise, very few species of
herpetofauna are distributed in the Himalaya region while as it is densely distributed
around the Terai region and Churia range. Before 1998, the publication of
herpetofauna was very limited. Hardly any student or researcher was interested
to do research in herpetofauna. The enlisted checklists of herpetofauna were 43
species of amphibians and 105 species of reptiles (Biodiversity Profiles
Project 1995). Additionally, there were no other authentic publications to make
research references. We had to depend on the publications of foreign authors. But
now the situation has changed.
Almost two decades ago I determined to
find out the actual data of herpetofauna from Nepal. I boldly overcame all kind
of hurdles encountered during my PhD work and ultimately I ended successfully. As
my contributory result of research I added 5 new species of Amphibians (Icthyophis
sikkimensis, Megophrys robusta, Rhacophorus maximus, Sphaerotheca rolandae and Nanorana patenagensis), 2
new species of turtles (Cyclemys oldhamii and Pangshura tentoria circumdata), 2 new species of
lizards (Gekko gecko and Japalura tricarinata), 4 new species of
snakes (Psammodynastes pulverulentus,
Trimeresurus tibetanus, Oreocryptophis porphyraceus and Coelognathus radiatus) in the existing
checklist of herpetofauna of Nepal. For comprehensive and updated checklist of Nepal’s
herpetofauna you can consult the books, Amphibians and Reptiles of Nepal
(Schleich & Kästle 2002) and Field Guide to Amphibians and Reptiles of
Nepal (Kästle, Rai & Schleich 2013). Besides, I still had left to confirm many
species from the previously collected specimens of fieldwork but due to several
circumstances I could not accomplish them as a whole. Hopefully if you like many
new energetic researcher of herpetology step in this field, then it would fulfil
this requirement and lead upcoming generation.
Why should people care and conserve
these slithery, intimidating and (some) venomous creatures?
Herpetofauna are wild animals and
they are not harmful unless you hurt them or damage their natural habitats. The
ignorant people think they are ugly and venomous animals and kill wherever they
find one. I am against such cruelty. Some superstition stricken people may
think these animals are sign of bad luck and avoid looking them. There are some
crazy people; if he or she encounters any garden lizard or monitor lizard
crossing trail or road then they divert their way to other direction. Such is
the concept of our society. Many Nepali proverbs are also denoted by the name
of some herpetofauna. E.g. ‘Ghamandi bhyaguto’ (Proudy frog), ‘Chheparole rang
phere jasto’ (Silly person who cheat others), ’Chheparole bato katnu’ (Crossing
road by lizards), ‘Chheparoko katha’ (Lizard’s story or never achievement of purpose),
‘Gohiko anshu’ (Tear of crocodile), ‘Kachhuwa hidai’ (Sluggish movement), etc.
So every proverb appears in negative sense. But with the development of science
and technology such old concept of people is being changed. In fact, there are
more beneficial herpetofauna than people think. Among hundreds of snake species
only two Family (of snakes) are highly venomous i.e. Elapidae (cobra and
karaits) and Viperidae (common vipers and Russel’s viper). These venomous
snakes do not attack until you vex or disturb them. They are helpful for people
because they feed on rodents from the croplands and storehouses. All the
species of amphibians and most of lizards are insectivores. So they play
important biological role for controlling harmful insects. Similarly, turtles
are very important for purifying detritus in aquatic ecosystem. It is also
known as symbol of wetland. Some species of frogs and turtles are good source
of protein in many parts of the world. So, most species of herpetofauna are not
only harmful but they are inevitably beneficial to mankind in large. Hopefully
the new generation will generate friendly atmosphere and appreciate these
unique faunas and finally conserve them in their natural habitat knowing their
innate importance.
As a leading herpetologist of Nepal,
how do you think should it be conserved?
Yes, it is urgently needed to
conserve the threatened species of herpetofauna from our country. The main
reason of wild animals being endangered is its habitat loss. So, we should protect
such sensitive areas by insitu or exsitu conservation methods. Wetlands and
forests are fundamental habitats of all herpetofauna. So, first of all we
should select the right place for conservation of specific herpetofauna.
Thereafter, an extensive public awareness programme should be given to the
local people in those chosen areas before establishing any new conservation
project. Unfortunately, very less NGO and INGOs are giving priority on this
subject in Nepal. But one non-government organization ARCO-Nepal (www.arco-nepal.de)
is running its project on Herpetofauna of Nepal for more than two decades.
Even though, some university students and researchers are interested to do research work on herpetology of Nepal. Initially, herpetological conservation centres have been established in the Government protected areas (Gharial Conservation and Breeding Centre at Chitwan National Park) as well as in community based organization such as Bhadrapur Turtle Conservation Centre (TCC) and Turtle Rescue and Conservation Centre-TRCC, Jhapa. TRCC is a joint venture program of Sukhani Martyrs Memorial Foundation (SUMMEF) and Amphibian and Reptile Conservation of Nepal (ARCO-Nepal). All such activities prove that nowadays, the conservation and management work for threatened species of herpetofauna is being carried out.
Even though, some university students and researchers are interested to do research work on herpetology of Nepal. Initially, herpetological conservation centres have been established in the Government protected areas (Gharial Conservation and Breeding Centre at Chitwan National Park) as well as in community based organization such as Bhadrapur Turtle Conservation Centre (TCC) and Turtle Rescue and Conservation Centre-TRCC, Jhapa. TRCC is a joint venture program of Sukhani Martyrs Memorial Foundation (SUMMEF) and Amphibian and Reptile Conservation of Nepal (ARCO-Nepal). All such activities prove that nowadays, the conservation and management work for threatened species of herpetofauna is being carried out.
Previously, I had run many research
projects to preserve and protect the herpetofauna of East Nepal. First of all,
I established herpetological conservation centre at Maipokhari (a ramsar site
in Ilam) to protect rare amphibian Himalayan newt (Tylototriton verrucossus). Being a chairman of Environment Conservation
Society-Nepal (ECS-Nepal), I collaborated with The East Foundation (TEF) and
WWF/CEPF and established Amphibian Conservation Centre at Gangatepani and
Gurashe in Ilam district. I also initiated to establish TRCC at Budhoholi
wetland area of Martyrs Memorial Park, Arjundhara municipality, Jhapa. In this
way I had suggested concerning stakeholders to save the biodiversity of Chauni pokhari,
Kechana jheel, Betana wetland, Hanspokhari, Jorpokhari, Pokna pokhari, Salpa
pokhari, Barapokhari, Rauta pokhari, etc. My ECS-Nepal team was my honest
friends and collaborators who help to conclude every project successfully. I
would like to thank them all.
Would you brief about Turtle
Conservation Centre in Bhadrapur?
Yes, for the first time I had
established a Turtle Conservation Centre (TCC) at Bhadrapur, Jhapa occupying an
area of 330 m2. It was divided into two sections, one for aquatic turtles
and other for tortoises. Two small ponds were built in the middle of aquatic section
and other section was open land for tortoises. In this terrestrial sector, small
caves and deep burrows were made and old logs were laid down for creating hiding
as well as nesting places. Slanting roof was constructed just above the rearing
ponds for protecting turtles from extreme heating of sunlight during summer.
Besides it, evergreen trees were planted at the marginal part of the TCC for
creating shadow in the site. Likewise, fruit producing plants such as papaya,
guava, mulberry, mango, lychee, banana, fig tree ‘dumri’, plum, etc were
planted within the terrestrial section of TCC for tortoises. The small ponds
were preconditioned with aquatic plants, e.g. water hyacinths, hydrilla, water
lilies, water lettuce, etc.
After creating suitable habitat at
TCC, specimens brought from different field sites were released here for two
years. The total number of collected turtle specimens was 25 and comprised 8
species. After finishing study and data collection of those specimens, half of
them was carried to Chitwan National Park and released in Turtle Conservation Program
at Kasara. The remaining 4 species of turtles including juveniles were reared
in Bhadrapur TCC until 2018. The master specimens of turtles were named
according to their place of collection. For instance, dark-throated leaf turtle
(Cyclemys oldhamii) which was
collected from Sakale khola of Laxmipur, Ilam district was named ‘Sakale
kachhuwa’ (Kachhuwa means turtle in Nepali). Likely, elongated tortoise (Indotestudo elongata) brought from Khambutar
Telpani of Bahundangi, Jhapa called ‘Telpane kachhuwa’, Indian flapshell turtle
(Lissemys punctata) brought from old
airport, Biratnagar called ‘Biratnagare kachhuwa’ and Indian peacock softshell turtle
(Nilssonia hurum) brought from Betana
wetland of Belbari, Morang was called ‘Betane kachhuwa’ respectively. After a
few months of brining, Peacock softshell turtle it escaped from TCC by climbing
4 feet high brick wall, which was not smoothened by plaster. But the remaining
3 species of turtles were reared and adapted in this TCC for several years to
come. Since the time of establishment, several students, teachers, researchers
and other nature loving persons from different schools, campus, university,
organizations and places visited this TCC for gaining knowledge by observing
them. Several students of Zoology from Post Graduate Campus, Biratnagar (PG
campus) completed their dissertation works on Master's level on turtle fauna
from this TCC under the stipend of ARCO-Nepal. During their research survey
period, they rescued and collected several turtles including two male elongated
tortoises from different threatened habitats.
In the first decade (2005 to 2010)
the elongated tortoise ‘Telpane kachhuwa’ and Indian flapshell turtle started
to lay their eggs in Bhadrapur TCC. In the first breed, Indotestudo elongata laid 6 eggs and Lissemys punctata laid only 2 eggs. The spot where turtles laid
their eggs were traced and left them undisturbed in same condition in their nests.
In addition, special care was taken to protect it from predators. After
completion of the gestation period, 4 hatchlings of Indotestudo elongata emerged in healthy condition where as remaining
2 eggs of Indotestudo and 2 eggs of Lissemys were aborted. The size of newly
hatched baby turtles was 45 mm. The baby tortoises were cared with special
attention and it was also observed that the hatchlings had slow growth rate. It
only attained 70 mm in one year. Towards the second year of hatchlings, PG
students used them for special study in their dissertation work. But one of the
hatchling got infected due to handling and became sick. It was treated locally
but did not survive. Likewise, another mishap occurred during the third year;
one of the growing juvenile (out of three) was found dead in winter due to cold
weather. The remaining pair of juveniles was reared with special care and after
4-5 years they attained better size and started to live independent life.
The parent of these juveniles had
created a legend which goes like this:
There were two male father tortoises
and only one female tortoise ‘Telpane mother’ of these living juveniles. But every
breeding year those two competing male Elongated tortoises fought vigorously
for courtship and become wounded by biting each other. In such fighting, one
male died with bad injury. Thereafter, the remaining male ‘Gaide tortoise’
became monogamous and occupied female ‘Telpane tortoise’ for few years. Even
after absence of competing male, the same type of courtship fight took place
between male and female every year before copulation. The female tortoise ‘Telpane
mother’ continued to lay eggs for next two years but none eggs were saved for
hatchling. The main reason of losing eggs was due to stealing by cunning and
cruel birds, especially crow and cuckoos. As the predator birds locate the
hiding eggs of turtles in nest, they uncovered it and ate directly. As such the
existing female tortoise ‘Telpane mother’ was more harassed from the regular attack
of male; it became old earlier and died premature. Then only male Indotestudo elongata ‘Gaide tortoise’
was left at TCC and the breeding process of this species was also stopped.
Thereafter, those pair of juvenile tortoises lived with father ‘Gaide tortoise’
till 2016.
During the same year in collaboration
of Sukhani Martyrs Memorial Foundation (SUMMEF) and Amphibian and Reptile
Conservation of Nepal (ARCO-Nepal), a full-size and well managed Turtle Rescue
and Conservation Centre-TRCC was being completed in the premise of Martyrs Memorial
Park at Salbari, Arjundhara municipaliy-9, Jhapa. In the same year President of
ARCO-Nepal and renowned herpetologist Prof. Dr. Hermann Schleich had come to
Nepal to start off TRCC formally. So the Park committee of SUMMEF had organized
a turtle releasing program in new TRCC and I decided to transfer that male Indotestudo elongata ‘Gaide tortoise’
from Bhadrapur TCC to TRCC. Eventually, I handover ‘Gaide tortoise’ to
ARCO-Nepal’s President Prof. Dr. Hermann Schleich and SUMMEF’s Chairman Mr.
Devraj Ghimire; and they jointly released it in newly established TRCC in 2016.
After that a pair of juvenile Elongated
tortoises, one Dark-throated leaf turtle and one Indian flapshell turtle remained
at Bhadrapur TCC. The Dark-throated leaf turtle had no male and as such it
could not breed to produce offspring. But it had lived in Bhadrapur TCC for 19
years. Similarly, Indian flaspshell turtle did not breed because it had no
male. This flapshell turtle is common in wetlands of terai region but is very
sensitive to climatic change. As its characteristic this species prefers to
live in muddy or wet environment. At the end of last monsoon, a school boy of
11 years old (Sougat) found small juvenile of Indian flapshell turtle on the
road and brought at Bhadrapur TCC with his father Mr. Jiwan Shrestha. A few
months later this juvenile flapshell turtle was sent to TRCC for special care. The
two juvenile Elongated tortoises were growing to become a sub-adult. Unfortunately
one of the female died due to extreme cold in last winter of 2017. It was found
hidden under the crevice of banana plant roots to escape from extreme cold but
mishap occurred because the hiding place could not generate sufficient heat to keep
it alive. Another mishap also occurred in the winter of 2018. The flapshell
turtle was hiding inside a heap of accumulated dry weeds and leaf litters. Unknowingly
the worker burnt that heap of dry plants and thus the hiding turtle was also slightly
burnt at its carapace. The wounded turtle was treated with medicine but did not
survive.
Thereafter, only two specimens of
two species of turtles remained at Bhadrapur TCC till first week of April,
2018. Ultimately, I decided to transfer the remaining species of turtles from
Bhadrapur TCC to ARCO-TRCC of Martyrs Memorial Park, Salbari, Arjundhara,
Jhapa. These remaining turtles were transferred from Bhadrapur TCC to TRCC in an
important program held on April 6, 2018.
In that special turtle releasing ceremony, I handover the son of ‘Telpane’
elongated tortoise to chief guest Honourable Minister, Ministry of Industry,
Tourism, Forests and Environment of Province No. 1, Nepal Mr. Jagadish Prasad Kusiyait
and handover ‘Sakale’ dark-throated leaf turtle to special guest President of
ARCO-Nepal Prof. Dr. Hermann Schleich to release them in their respective
habitats. In this way all the turtles which were reared and grown in Bhadrapur
TCC since 19 years were transferred at ARCO-TRCC of Sukhani Martyrs Memorial
Park, Salbari, Arjundhara from April 2018. Now, I hope those turtles will be
well protected from all sorts of adverse factors and live for long time happily
with other turtles in well developed conservation centre.
This much about Bhadrapur TCC.
This much about Bhadrapur TCC.
What were your sweetest and bitter
experiences while working in the field?
The incident of slipping down the
top of hanging cliff at Solukhumbu district was the unhappiest moment in my
life where as finding ‘Rakpa’ Megophrys
robusta was the happiest moment during my field work. For detail you can
read my book ‘Khambu’s way: crossroad in new lands’ which was published in 2018.
Is there any mantra for successful and
best quality research?
“Honesty is the best policy.” “Persistency
means victory.” “A man can be destroyed but not defeated.” “Standing at the
foot, boy, gazing at the sky, how can you get up, boy, if you never try!!” It
means if you have to start research work, you should be self convinced and do
your work independently.
These are ‘Guru Mantra’ (master
formulae) of being success in every kind of research in one’s life.
What is life actually?
Life is Struggle! Really, every
moment struggling for existence as Charles Darwin said.
Gratitude for sharing your time! Lastly,
what are your advices for Turtle Rescue and Conservation Centre – TRCC?
Thanks for taking my interview.
I would like to share my experiences
gained from ‘Bhadrapur Turtle Conservation Centre’ as follows:
- The turtle habitat should be managed on the basis of geographical location and should be protected from extreme hot and cold weather.
- Naturally a vigorous fight occurs between male turtles during breeding time. So it is better to keep them separate in the conservation centre.
- If the ecosystems of aquatic section and terrestrial section of conservation centre are naturally maintained, the renewable food may help to sustain in external feeding.
- The eggs of turtles are very delicate and could be damaged easily. So, special precautions should be taken when turtles are laying eggs and thus laid eggs should be handled carefully.
- Protecting eggs from predators is very important. During breeding time, crows and cuckoo birds become active to steal the eggs of turtles. Therefore, special care should be maintained in the egg laying period.
- Hatchling of turtles is very delicate. So I would suggest better use incubator or air conditioned room for maintaining favourable environment to rear them.
- Next important thing is periodical checking of parasites in turtles, especially endoparasites and ectoparasites frequently infect tortoises. So, their faeces and body checkups should be done regularly. Sometimes round worms are found in the intestine and its eggs and worms come out with faecal material. In other hand, ticks and mites are main ectoparasites of turtles. If they are infested with parasites, the sick turtle becomes restless and reddish lesion appear around the base of foots and tail region. In such situation, consult with veterinary doctor and ask for ectoparasitic drug. During treatment the sick turtle should be kept in quarantine separately. And so on…
Thank you very much Sir for
providing your precious time and bestowing with bulk of knowledge.
Dr. Khambu giving instruction to
Field Coordinator TP Rai (present Interviewer) in 2008 while running a project ‘Conservation
of Amphibians in Key Sites of Kangchenjunga-Singalilla Complex’
Note: This interview was taken by Lead Keeper & Representative of Turtle Rescue and Conservation Centre-TRCC Mr. Tapil Prakash
Rai few months ago in 2019.
